I have some less-lethal launchers like the Umarex HDR 68 and HDB 68, as well as a Byrna LE. The Umarex ones are tuned for more power. I’ve been on a mission to figure out the best kinetic projectiles for them. I used a chronograph and built my own tester for penetration. After trying out projectiles of various weights—3g, 4.5g, 7.3g, 7.7g, 9.9g, 12g, and 20g—I found that 8.4g solid rounds hit the sweet spot for penetration and compatibility. I even had some made and tested them in real situations, not just in theory. They worked so well that I started a company to produce them, calling them “The Smasher” from Less Lethal Ballistics. I think these are a game-changer for getting the most out of your launchers. What do you all think? Feedback is welcome!
Wait, so you’re basically turning a paintball gun into something you can use for self-defense by switching out the paintballs for solid rounds? Is the goal to scare off or hurt an intruder with the impact?
@Arlo
Exactly! I’m pushing the limits of what these launchers can do. Paintball rounds are super light, usually under 3.2g, and the markers are capped at around 200 fps for safety reasons. Companies like Byrna and Grimburg have been working on more powerful CO2 launchers and heavier rounds. My 8.4g projectiles give even more stopping power and can work with almost any marker. If you’re interested, you can find more details here:
https://lesslethalballistics.com
Bottom line: Any launcher can pack a bigger punch with these projectiles.
@Nova
What exactly are you testing penetration on?
Arlo said:
@Nova
What exactly are you testing penetration on?
I’ve tested them on a lot of materials, but my main focus is on realistic home defense scenarios. These projectiles are totally legal everywhere in the U.S. and could definitely stop a threat or scare off an intruder.
@Nova
Has anyone tested whether using these for self-defense has held up legally in court?
Arlo said:
@Nova
Has anyone tested whether using these for self-defense has held up legally in court?
The Smasher projectiles are less damaging than even a subsonic .22 round but are still the most effective option within the CO2 launcher category. I just want to maximize self-defense options without needing permits. I hope courts don’t take away all our rights to defend ourselves without government approval. Seriously, where does it stop? Will we need permits for rocks next?
@Nova
Why not just get a firearm if you’re that worried about self-defense?
Arlo said:
@Nova
Why not just get a firearm if you’re that worried about self-defense?
Firearms are heavily regulated in many states, with long waiting periods and licensing requirements. CO2 launchers, on the other hand, are legal to buy without permits and can be shipped directly to your door. It’s a huge convenience and keeps me out of government registries. Plus, this is a less-lethal option, which is more humane but still effective at stopping an intruder.
@Nova
Got it. Thanks for explaining.
@Arlo
Here’s a video showing what these launchers can do:
Quick question: Do the 8.4g projectiles match the bore of the barrel the best out of all the options? A tight fit can really improve performance.
Ross said:
Quick question: Do the 8.4g projectiles match the bore of the barrel the best out of all the options? A tight fit can really improve performance.
The diameter of my projectiles is precisely 17.27 mm, give or take 0.025 mm. I reverse-engineered this size after measuring hundreds of rounds from other manufacturers.
@Nova
How does that compare to the sizes of the other weights you tested?
Ross said:
@Nova
How does that compare to the sizes of the other weights you tested?
I measured hundreds of projectiles from about 20 different brands. Most are between 0.680" and 0.683". I chose a size that works well with the majority of barrels on the market. While diameter matters, mass is the key factor for penetration.
@Nova
I wasn’t saying diameter doesn’t matter. My question is, when you found that 8.4g projectiles performed best, was it due to their mass or because they had the closest fit to the bore?
Ross said:
@Nova
I wasn’t saying diameter doesn’t matter. My question is, when you found that 8.4g projectiles performed best, was it due to their mass or because they had the closest fit to the bore?
Good question. I found that the optimal weight for penetration forms a parabola, and the peak is at 8.4g. It wasn’t just about the fit—it was the balance of weight and CO2 power. I had to create custom molds to get this weight, combining a steel core with a polyethylene coating. After testing, they consistently outperformed both lighter and heavier rounds.
@Nova
What kind of penetration tests did you do? Did you also measure joules during the testing?
Ross said:
@Nova
What kind of penetration tests did you do? Did you also measure joules during the testing?
I built a tester using cardboard sheets spaced apart, simulating layers of resistance. All tests were done at 5 meters, which is a typical home defense range. I also used a chronograph to measure FPS, which varies with room temperature. The data confirmed that 8.4g was the sweet spot for penetration, regardless of the launcher’s power.